It’s a Gas…

I suppose you could go in a couple of directions with such a title, including ones not so appropriate, but since this is an RVing blog – we’re talkin’ propane.

For those entering the RV world with a brand new rig, you may be thinking there isn’t much to worry over. As long as the tanks are full, you’re good to go. Not so fast. Remember, those tanks contain an explosive substance which can not only ruin your day. Anyone within your vicinity will be affected too. It’s not a bad idea to have the propane system and appliances checked before ever using them, preferably at the dealership during the delivery walk-thru. There is always the possibility something broke or disconnected during shipment from the factory to the dealership. If there is a problem, make sure a warranty covers the fix. Pay close attention to manufacturer instructions concerning safe operation of the entire system, read up on how the regulator works (be prepared to replace it every few years), make sure your interior alarms are always working, and resign yourself to the fact that it really is a good idea to have a properly equipped professional inspect the system periodically*. Once a year is a good rule of thumb if your RV gets a lot of use and/or travels long distances regularly. Propane is another good reason to take yourself and the new RV to the many boot camps offered by various organizations. New-to-RVing vintage owners, who purchase from a restoration professional, should also follow this advice.

Here’s one good article about RV propane. Though it’s skewed a bit toward motorhomes, the info is applicable to any RV with a propane system.

http://www.rvdoctor.com/2001/01/avoiding-pitfalls-of-rv-propane-system.html

Ambitious DIYers shouldn’t do anything with their propane until thoroughly educated. Whatever you do, don’t just assume the old system is fine. Remember, vintage is classified as being 25 yrs. or older. Copper, being a soft metal, can degrade over time. Which means it becomes brittle. A trailer which traveled lots of miles has had plenty of opportunities for things to break and leak. While water leaks are a big problem, they are nothing compared to gas.

Ok, so you need new propane lines. What’s next? If you’ve done your research and really don’t feel comfortable doing this job yourself, hire RV professionals to do the work for you. Proceeding on your own? Then read on to learn of our experience replacing our propane lines.

It seems to make the most sense to replace like with like in this instance. Darn it! This is another project where you won’t find it that easy. Copper is one of those commodities where the manufacturers don’t seem to have a standard nomenclature. Until you learn to decipher it. To install a new copper system, you also need to know there is no such thing as one-stop shopping, unless you have a specialty supplier in your area. Even then fittings in less common sizes might not be easy to find. The specialty supplier down the road from us had very few flared fittings in their inventory. (Several empty bins though.) You might find an RV dealership who sells propane fittings. Visit those in your area that have parts departments and request their catalog. Some will have a really comprehensive book. If their store doesn’t actually stock items, they will order them for you. Our gas line is now finished, and the most aggravating and time consuming part was assembling all the components. It took us longer to find everything than it did to install it.

We must mention briefly, after consulting with our RV repair shop, that they were phasing out the use of copper for gas lines, and replacing it with black pipe. However, it’s not our area of expertise. Going the route of black pipe would definitely mean hiring a pro as far as we’re concerned.

To do a copper system, here’s your basic shopping list.

https://www.nachi.org/gallery/images/plumbing/general/copper-supply-pipes.jpg

Type L Copper - The walls of some copper tubing are thinner than others and aren’t recommended for propane lines (Type M). Type L is still malleable but not as likely to break if you need to bend it a bit. Type K, which has even thicker walls, might be suggested by some. We found it difficult to locate.

You need to consider the routes of your lines carefully. Make sure nothing is going to pinch, rub, or break the pipe. Be careful not to introduce sharp bends. They can create creases, which may cause premature failure. Buy a bit more than you think is needed. Following the same route as the manufacturer is probably OK, but make sure the original holes in the belly pan will provide a tight fit when securing the mounting brackets. If not, fill or cover them, otherwise you might eventually get water inside the pans where you don’t want it.

Flare Brass Fittings/Connectors

These fittings include flare nuts, tees and elbows; as well as gate style shut-off valves for each of your appliances. Do not use compression fittings. If you’ve never used flared fittings, try to find an opportunity to get a hands-on education before replacing your propane lines. Besides the possibility of wasting too much material, this is not the time to be learning/practicing a new skill.

Pipe Cutter/Flaring Tools

Aluminum LIne Clamps

Use the type pictured. The line has to be secured on the underside of your trailer, outside of the belly pans. Bare metal brackets are not a good idea. Friction due to travel will wear on the copper, and eventually cause breaks in the line. Make sure the clamps are the correct size for your tubing. The reason for keeping your propane lines from vibrating too much should be obvious. (If you've read some of our other posts you may have noticed the mention of many not-nice roads.)

Two-stage Regulator - Connected to the tanks and main line. The main line connection will be flare to pipe.

Hoses -To connect the tanks to the Regulator, and a Hose to connect the Regulator to the main line. (Must be rated for propane use.)

Here are the basics of a propane system. When your tanks are filled, it will be around 80%. Only gas vapor should be entering your lines. (Not liquid) The head room in your tanks allows that process to start, and accommodates any expansion of gas during temperature fluctuations. The regulator controls the flow of the vapor, making sure the appropriate amount is entering the gas lines. The main line carries the vapor to the rest of the system, meaning it’s the largest in diameter. The gas must be reduced before it reaches the appliances. Therefore, the lines to the appliances have to be smaller. The main rule, regardless of the pipe diameters you end up using, is always large to small. Not small to large. No exceptions. The main line diameter is determined by how many runs and total BTU’s.

Sounds simple doesn’t it. We thought so too, until we started shopping for parts. Then we encountered the conundrum known as manufacturer labeling. (Cue maniacal laugh) The copper supply lines and fittings come in two designations. Inner Diameter (ID) and Outer Diameter (OD). We knew our old lines were 5/8” and 3/8” OD. Once we got it sorted out that we needed Type L copper, it got easier to decipher the labeling on the pipe. At the big box home improvement stores, the 5/8” copper pipe is labeled as ½”. Which is referring to the inner diameter. When looking for the flared fittings, this pipe will require 5/8” OD flare nuts, which sit on the outside of the pipe. The fittings which thread into the flare nuts should be the same size. Confused yet? Now, here’s our most frustrating part of dealing with 5/8” fittings. We needed 5/8”x3/8”x5/8” tees to reduce from the main line to the appliances. That particular fitting is hard to find at the big boxes. We did finally locate it at a hardware store, along with the gate valves we wanted. Since we hadn’t bought them anywhere else, we got most of the other fittings there too. However, they were short on the number of tees and valves we wanted, which resulted in a special order from their warehouse. That order came up one short on a tee. We got lucky and did manage to dig up 1 and a spare on Amazon.

The 3/8” Type L (1/4” ID) wasn’t totally trouble free either. Once again it was labeling which was tripping us up. We could find 2 foot pieces of tubing labeled as Type L at the box store, but we needed longer lengths. It’s not a good idea to use lots of connections until you reach your desired length. Connections are potential leaks. None of the copper coils were labeled as Type L. The only one which came in the correct diameter was labeled as Refrigeration, was 50 ft. long and a little over a dollar a foot. (Ouch!) Turns out this is actually Type L, with an added step of capping the ends, ensuring no moisture is inside the tube. It took us more than a week to dig up and verify the information.

Needless to say, no matter how you approach this project, pro or DIY, it isn’t very cheap to do. Buying the copper doesn’t seem so bad. But, by the time you have all your brass fittings you could be looking at a sizable chunk of change. Your actual cost will be determined by the size of your RV and number of appliances using gas.

The expense will not stop with the gas lines either. Beyond just filling your tanks (AKA cylinders), there are government required inspections which you will need to do periodically, depending on age. There are refillable and exchangeable tanks. Don’t just assume your RV comes with refillables. New or used, make sure you know what kind of cylinders are being included. New tanks should come with OPD valves (overfill protection device). Older tanks will have OPDs if a previous owner used them long-term, and had the valves changed when their use was first required. Some information we’ve seen, mentioned refillable steel tanks can’t have the valves replaced, while aluminum tanks can. This information is best verified by a certified inspector. If your tanks fail an inspection, due to the valves, the inspector will let you know if they meet the requirement to receive new ones. And yes, it is an additional cost. The following articles explain the basics of propane tanks and OPD valves. To extend the life of steel tanks, keep abuse to a minimum. Excessive corrosion and dents are other reasons a steel tank fails inspection, in which case it will have to be replaced. As far as exchangeable tanks are concerned, you will want to do a convenience/cost comparison of “rental” vs. ownership of tanks. (Get a good, easy-to-use tank monitor regardless of tank type, so you don’t find yourself out of propane at an inopportune time. For exchangeable tanks, it’s best to take them back empty because you might not get credit for any gas still in the tank.)

We were fortunate our trailer came with two 40lb. aluminum cylinders. If you conclude you need to purchase, we recommend buying the aluminum. Yes, they are more expensive and may be heavier because of thicker walls. But they last a long time. Our tanks are original to our trailer and other than a couple of small scuffs, don’t look their age. (Yes, they have the OPDs. Thank you, P.O.)

http://www.propane101.com/propanecylinders.htm

http://www.propanetankstore.com/what-is-an-opd/

http://www.propane101.com/opdcylindervalves.htm

For those who are wondering if this info is really necessary, we say it’s better to be informed up front, before you decide if a certain dream suits your reality. Never mind the fact your dream is called a Recreational Vehicle. To all levels of government, you are transporting a hazardous material when that vehicle is carrying propane on a public roadway. At the very least, this activity is under the authority of the Department of Transportation (DOT). Some states will require additional certification for inspectors, like Texas. Here inspection of propane cylinders requires Railroad Commission certification, too. Such licensing might be optional for the RV professionals you hire to pressure test your lines. Certified or not, a trained professional will have the appropriate equipment to test for leaks and properly adjust the pressure of your regulator. The regulator can’t be adjusted with a spray bottle of soapy water. Just so you are aware, some LP refilling locations like gas stations, farm supply stores or RV parks, while legally liable to identify if it’s safe to refill your tanks, might not be licensed for inspection or equipped to replace old valves or defective OPDs. When it’s time to have your tanks annually inspected, you may have to take them to a dedicated LP supplier instead. (Blue Flame is one example.)

⃰ The only part of your propane system actually required by governments to be periodically inspected, are the propane tanks. We’re not recommending inspection of your gas lines due to any laws on the books, but because it’s a best practice that falls under the category of common sense. Though it’s not even required for a new system, why would you risk all the work you’ve done, any new or restored appliances, and most importantly, your family’s safety to save some money? Yes, paying a pro to check your propane could cost a couple hundred dollars. Seems like pretty cheap life insurance to us.

The following info is for the DIYer in particular, concerning the order of procedures.  Don’t be afraid to establish a relationship with RV professionals before you start any work on your gas lines. If you’re planning to have them inspect your system, they would prefer you know what you’re doing. Not certain about your tanks? Just plan on getting them inspected and filled before the pro checks your work. They should have been disconnected from the main line well before you removed the old copper, anyway. Do not let gas into your system before the pro is scheduled to check everything. They must be present the first time the gas is turned on. We received this information from a professional RV repairman. He has a mobile business and happens to store his trailer in the same storage lot we use. He helped us clear up some other things, such as reusing flared brass fittings, which he advised against. The only reason we even considered reusing the old fittings was the initial inability to find our 5/8” tees. By the way, if you start this project and decide you’re not comfortable with it, having an established relationship with a pro might help you get service a bit faster.

Still ready to take the plunge and get your RV? Go forth with confidence and enjoy your search. Remember, knowledge is power. Your knowledge will hopefully keep you from embarking on a restoration project you’re not prepared to finish. You also won’t regret knowing you can enjoy the benefits of your propane system, due to proper installation and maintenance.

A fellow AS owner gave us the info about flared fittings at the hardware store. Though we’re both from the same area north of Houston, he and his wife initially made contact with us thru Airforums, before they bought a trailer last fall. While they are DYI and RV travel newbies who have occasionally picked our brains, they paid us back big time with the info. Those 5/8”-3/8” tees were really giving us fits. Sometimes, it can take a village to finish a project such as RV restoration/renovation. And you never know where useful information is going to come from. M & M, if you happen to read this post, thank you from the bottom of our hearts. You saved us from a lot of aggravation.